Subj:	TRAVELLER digest 279
Date:	95-05-08 20:46:33 EDT
From:	traveller@mpgn.com
To:	traveller@mpgn.com

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			    TRAVELLER Digest 279

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) High Science, Low Tech
	by Rob_Prior@nynet.nybe.north-york.on.ca (Rob Prior)
  2) TRAVELLER digest 277
	by bvanbra@bvemx.ppco.com
  3) TRAVELLER digest 238
	by bvanbra@bvemx.ppco.com
  4) Saturn V plans
	by "Harold D. Hale" <hdhale@smtpwpo.dayt.tasc.com>
  5) Starship Construction Spreadsheet
	by Kevin Combs <kevin013@access.digex.net>

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: 07 May 1995 22:03:41 GMT
From: Rob_Prior@nynet.nybe.north-york.on.ca (Rob Prior)
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: High Science, Low Tech
Message-ID: <3229187639.131433288@nynet.nybe.north-york.on.ca>

If you want to see what a properly designed low-tech device looks like, check
out some of the "sustainable technology" designs used at the UNICEF Village
(in Kenya).  These devices make use of local material and can be made by
virtually anyone, but are optimized in terms of 'science'.  The tin can
stove, for example, is designed for maximum cooking from minimum fuel.  The
science behind these devices is several tech levels above the technology
needed to make them.

Of course, this is an issue that Traveller avoids entirely (the difference
between knowing something and being able to use the knowledge).  For example,
the germ theory of disease is tech 4 (by discovery), yet once you know about
it even tech 0 can use it.  So which tech level is it really, 4 or 0?  

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 01:24:08 -0500
From: bvanbra@bvemx.ppco.com
To: "SMTPMAIL-TRAVELLE (052)" <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 277
Message-ID: <0011200001146726000002*@MHS>

To: TRAVELLE--SMTPMAIL
 
*** Reply to note of 05/06/95 18:23
From: Bart Van Brabant-Phillips Petroleum Int. AG (IS-DEPT)
     355 Brusselsesteenweg 3090 Overijse Belgium
     Tel: 32-2-6891375 Fax: 32-2-6891472
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 277
I just bought the Traveller New Era book and the Star Vikings Supplemental.
I noticed however, no rules for shipdesign are given in both books.
 
They give a reference to FF&S and Brilliant Lances. WHich of the two should
I order to have a complete shipdesign (and other things) manual.
 
Bart
 
I finally found it in Belgium although it was not so cheap |
 
X400: C=US,A=ATTMAIL,P=PHILLIPS66,OU1=P66,S=VAN BRABANT,G=BART
Internet Address:bvanbra@ppco.com
USPPC7XC@IBMMAIL, EVOKER@IBM.NET
NNNN

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 05:55:37 -0500
From: bvanbra@bvemx.ppco.com
To: "SMTPMAIL-TRAVELLE (052)" <traveller@MPGN.COM>
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 238
Message-ID: <0011200001146853000002*@MHS>

To: TRAVELLE--SMTPMAIL
 
*** Reply to note of 03/29/95 20:06
From: Bart Van Brabant-Phillips Petroleum Int. AG (IS-DEPT)
     355 Brusselsesteenweg 3090 Overijse Belgium
     Tel: 32-2-6891375 Fax: 32-2-6891472
Subject: TRAVELLER digest 238
I bought the GDW Traveller the New Era game book and the supplement star
viking
s this weekend. Although I find nowhere any rules for shipdesign. I only find
r
eferences to FF&S and Brilliant Lances. Which one should I buy to have a
comple
te manual to build new, improved ships ?
 
Btw, Are there any BeNeLux traveller fans on this reading list (Belgium,
Nether
lands an Luxembourg) ? I would appreciate to get in touch with you.
 
Regards
Bart Van Brabant
 
X400: C=US,A=ATTMAIL,P=PHILLIPS66,OU1=P66,S=VAN BRABANT,G=BART
Internet Address:bvanbra@ppco.com
USPPC7XC@IBMMAIL, EVOKER@IBM.NET
NNNN

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 May 1995 10:15:18 -0400
From: "Harold D. Hale" <hdhale@smtpwpo.dayt.tasc.com>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Saturn V plans
Message-ID: <sfadef19.045@smtpwpo.dayt.tasc.com>

Mark Clark writes:

>From Sci.space.tech FAQ
>
>The problem in re-creating the Saturn V is not finding the drawings, it is
>finding vendors who can supply mid-1960's vintage hardware (like
>guidance system components), and the fact that the launch pads and
>VAB have been converted to Space Shuttle use, so you have no place
>to launch from.

   Ideally you would bring together a Lockheed Shunkworks type
team who would go over the plans and find suitable 1990s replacements
for the 1960's technology.  It wouldn't be that difficult actually, if your
team didn't have to worry about NASA bureaucracy, or AlGore
pressuring them to shake hands with the President more often, or
Congressman or Senator So-and-So leaning on them to buy parts from
specific vendors in Congressman or Senator So-and-So's district.
Launch pads just require that money be thrown at them--again not
that difficult (you have to build them from scratch, of course).

>By the time you redesign to accommodate available hardware and
>re-modify the launch pads, you may as well have started from scratch
>with a clean sheet design.

   Not if you use the Skunk Works approach.  For those who don't
know what I'm talking about, basically Lockheed figured out back in
the 1940's that the best way to build an airplane (especially
something like the SR-71) was to hire the best and the brightest, put
them in an environment where they are free to experiment with new
concepts and designs, give them the tools they need to work, and give
them some goal to work toward (build a spy plane, jet fighter, etc).  The
result is some of the most innovative aeronautical design in aviation
history (the F-117 was theirs as well I believe).  Their approach would
work with designing a Saturn VI or whatever you want to call it.

   Suggested readings:
 
Rich, Ben R.
  Skunk Works : a personal memoir of my years at Lockheed / Ben R.
Rich and Leo Janos.  1st ed.  Boston : Little, Brown, c1994.  x, 370 p.,
[8] p. of plates : ill. ; 25 cm.

Pace, Steve.
  Lockheed Skunk Works / Steve Pace.  Osceola, WI : Motorbooks
International, c1992.  288 p. : ill. ; 24 cm.


>    Several AIAA papers delivered in recent years discuss reviving the
>    Saturn V. For example, AIAA paper 92-1546, "Launch Vehicles for 
>    the Space Exploration Initiative". This paper concluded that a revived
>    Saturn V was actually cheaper than the NLS vehicle.

   Discussions of this study were published in a number of other
aerospace publications a while back.  God forbid NASA do anything
that innovative (yes, bringing back old design and updating it can be
innovative)--not that it matter much anyway, they wouldn't get the
funding.  These days most of the battle of getting into space is not
the engineering, it's finding the money and fighting the government
bull ^&^%(*.  <SIGH>

   Sorry, I have to go re-watch Kennedy's speech on sending a man
to the moon before I get depressed....


--Harold


------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 May 1995 11:27:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kevin Combs <kevin013@access.digex.net>
To: traveller@MPGN.COM
Subject: Starship Construction Spreadsheet
Message-ID: <Pine.SUN.3.91.950508111956.2182A-100000@access1.digex.net>

Hey all,

I've been working on a Starship construction spreadsheet in Lotus 4.0 for 
Windows.  Now, I will admit that I haven't looked at it in a while (work 
has been very busy), but I'd like to get some feedback if possible.  I 
know that at one time there was a committee set-up to design/review 
designs of starships.  Is that still around?  Any help on this would be 
appreciated.  Seeing Mike Basinger's post about his spreadsheet reminded 
me that I also had something along this line.  

Kevin
  

    ********************************************************************
    * "We're not retreating.  We're just advancing in a new direction."*
    ********************************************************************



------------------------------

End of TRAVELLER Digest 279
***************************


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